Early and informal resolution

If managers can resolve conflict through informal discussion before things escalate, they can save those involved, themselves and the organisation a lot of stress, time and money. However, many managers feel safer working through formal processes or avoid difficult issues altogether. In this episode, Richard is joined by Terry Duffy, Strategic Growth Partnership Lead. Together they look at the benefits of early and informal resolution. They ask what informal resolution really means and how managers can use it to solve difficult workplace problems. They also discuss situations when a more formal route might be more appropriate.

Transcript

Benefits of Informal Conflict Resolution

Speaker 1 0:00

Hello , I'm Professor Richard Saundry , and this is the Skilled Managers podcast . If managers can resolve conflict through informal discussion before things escalate , they can save those involved themselves and the organisation a lot of stress , time and money . However , many managers feel safer working through formal processes or avoid difficult issues altogether . In today's episode , I'm joined by Terry Duffy . Terry Duffy Now Terry , is ACAS's strategic growth partnership lead . He's an experienced mediator and conciliator and is perfectly placed to discuss the benefits of informal resolution , the do's and don'ts of informal resolution , and also to look at the types of situations where a more formal route might be more appropriate . Terry , thanks very much for coming along today . One of the key things I'd like to start with is the the benefits of early intervention . It's something we talk about on the skill managers course a lot . I wonder whether , for you , what do you see as being being being the the key plus points about managers intervening early in a potential conflict , or something that's bubbling under the surface ?

Speaker 2 1:28

Thanks , richard . Yeah , I would always say that early intervention is the right thing to do . I think what it does is it allows the issue to be dealt with at the lowest possible level of any emotional involvement or escalation , or indeed , uh , an individual being allowed to get away with things for a while and believing that that is their entitlement or their right , and then a manager has to come in and correct . It's much easier to do it first off , uh , before that , that kind of say that investment in , can I say , the problem grows . I think one of the things I would say , richard , though , when you are considering early intervention and what you mentioned at the start there about decision making , I think managers sometimes do need to take that moment to pause and to think do I need to do anything ?

Speaker 2 2:23

And if I do have to do something , what should that something look like ? And then perhaps we can talk about what the different kind of tools and options a manager has at their disposal .

Speaker 1 2:35

So it's taking a beat a little bit , isn't it ? It's trying to not jump right in with both feet straight away , which I guess you know , when we're encouraging managers to intervene early and address issues , there's a bit of a danger that people might do . You know , people might do that and thinking I've got to really grab this issue and might actually just just perhaps handle something unwisely where they where . They just need to just just think about it a little bit absolutely .

Speaker 2 3:00

I think what , how ? I've always tried to . When I've spoken to Calixier managers about this very issue , and I think it was when you talked about taking a beat . That's exactly it , because I think there's a difference between reacting and responding to something , and I think the response is where you have taken that beat . Taken that beat , you might even have that beat , might be just taking a breath , richard , before you can consider what you're going to say and how you're going to say it , and sometimes a reaction is that's the thing . Where can I say it might inflame the situation because you might react , you might , can I say , raise your voice , you might be emotional , and that can escalate the conflict , rather than , can I say , allows you to respond and deal with it in a professional and considered way .

Speaker 1 3:46

Yeah , yeah , and I mean a lot of the managers I speak to who are perhaps a little bit hesitant , perhaps lacking a bit of confidence , when I talk about early intervention . Sometimes their response is but they worry about making things worse if they intervene early . So sometimes a bit of a tendency just to wait and see how things develop , because they don't want to have that conversation too quickly because it might just exacerbate the issue . It might wind people up in the wrong way , you , it might wind people up in the wrong way again . What ? What are your views on that in terms of you know , that sort of wait and see approach , the dangers to that , or might that be the right thing to do in certain situations ?

Speaker 2 4:32

I think my experience says that , that the wait and see often often leads that you've got to do something .

Speaker 2 4:37

And again it takes us back to that point that , um , somebody could turn around and say , well , you've been watching me do this for , can I say , the last three weeks now , why didn't you say something earlier ? And I think that can be a difficult thing for the manager to actually have to deal with . I think what I would say in that , can I say , wait and see is well , think about , can I say , all of the all the approaches that you have . So so talking to a member of your team is something that is is perhaps an everyday activity and , yeah , and raising issues at that stage is probably just normal part of discourse between a manager and an individual . But I often I often think that the wait and see approach I'm not saying that it it doesn't work in some situations and individuals will work out kinds of problems , but more often than not it doesn't . I think the other challenge you've got , richard , on this is particularly if there is a team environment going on as well as the manager sitting and waiting and seeing .

Speaker 2 5:42

You get like a wider audience who are waiting and seeing and thinking why isn't the manager doing anything ? So so reputationally there can be , can I say , an issue for the manager being seen not to be managing . And can I say the further risk is that you get , you get . Can I say people following and say , well , okay , if it's okay for one person not to do it , maybe it's okay for me not to do it , and then the manager's got a bigger problem on their hands .

Speaker 1 6:08

Yeah , it's really interesting actually , in a lot of the research that we do , when we do sort of engagement surveys of staff or the views of staff in terms of how do you think your manager is handling conflict . The biggest problem that emerges from that is the concern that their manager isn't addressing conflict issues obviously not with them , but with their colleagues Because that , as you say , that can lead to feelings of unfairness or the people having to carry members of the team who are coming in late or the manager's not addressing that , so that you can really disrupt , disrupt the sort of smooth working and the good relationships in a team If you allow those issues to go , you know to go unaddressed , can't you Absolutely Just moving on a little bit Again , one of the issues that comes comes out of discussions I have with managers and some of the research we do is that managers are often told or urged to resolve things informally .

Speaker 1 7:11

so act early first , but also try to resolve things through informal discussion as opposed to formal procedure . I think sometimes we sort of assume that managers know what we mean by informal and the managers that I talk to , I think sometimes are not always clear about you know , what's formal , what's informal , what's formal ? Where does the , where do you draw the line , particularly when managers are quite often told by sort of HR and their organizations to be very careful and to , you know , be concerned about , you know , not taking actions which might , you know , expose the organization to risk and things like that . When we talk about informal resolution , what to you , what does that informal mean ? What does that word mean ?

Speaker 2 8:00

Well , I think that's a really , really good question and when I've spoken to managers about it , I've always modelled informal means of dealing with things , like in a way that almost mirrors some of the things which exist in the formal procedures . So , for example , fact finding . Now in a formal , can I say , procedure , richard , you might , can I say , call that an investigation and you might have an investigation stage to it . Well , you need to know what you're talking about at the informal stage . So there will be a degree of , can I say , fact finding , ie investigating to look at what is going on , but it just might be carried out in a different way . So you might do it as the manager you know . Different way , so you might do it as the manager you know , and you might just gather , gather some , some information and and and kind of say evidence to be able to present something as the individual , because I think that takes it away from just being a calix , a , an unhelpful comment saying , well , you're not doing very well at your job , richard . Well , that doesn't really help you to understand what I need you to do . Whereas I've looked and I said well over do . Whereas if I've looked and I said well over the last week , what I've looked at . I've looked at , can I say , the conversions you've had of referrals I've given you and you've only converted 25% of them In the past . You've been able to do 75 . What's the gap ? We can have a conversation about that .

Speaker 2 9:26

I think the other thing about informal it isn't going to be a meeting . You're going to sit down , you're going to have a conversation , you're going to want to say things to the individual , they'll want to say things to you and then you'll decide what the course of action is . You might also seek advice or speak to others around it . You might turn around and before you go in there , check in with HR about , kind of say what the policy or procedure is . Or you might look around for things such as well what are my options in terms of training ? So for me it's about the .

Speaker 2 10:05

I suppose the difference , the key differences between them , is who's owning the outcome ? Richard and by that I mean the informal approach would be collaborative . It would be agreed , there would be a plan of action drawn up as an outcome of that informal intervention . A formal Calix8 meeting might still have that as one of the expectations . Informal CalixA meeting might still have that as one of the expectations , but it might also carry some kind of consequence alongside it , such as and we're serious and we're giving you do them might differ and that's , can I say , a key difference between informal and formal action no-transcript tend to focus a little bit , when they define informal or formal , on process .

Speaker 1 11:25

So one what ? One particular issue that managers have spoke to me a lot about is well , can you take notes in an informal meeting or does that make it formal ? If I start to take a note , does that make it for ? And I actually have people who've said I didn't take a note of that meeting because I didn't think you were allowed to and I just thought what's your sort of thought on that in terms of things like , you know , keeping a written record , planning the meeting , that type of thing which has an air of formality about it ? I guess yeah , but I mean , I think I'd argue that , depending on the way in which you do it , you know , keeping a note of the meeting or or or planning out , even you know , maybe writing out some things you want to cover in in that meeting , is actually just sort of good practice rather than anything else . I mean , what's your view on that ?

Speaker 2 12:11

absolutely , yeah , um , writing things down , making a note , a record of things , is , uh , does not make it formal , um , and it is absolutely best practice to do that to have clarity , uh , for you about what you have done and for the individual about what the expectations might be . You you can say discuss it , you record it , you share it . That allows the person to have a record of it . What it also does is it gives you can say , that platform that if you are going to move to a to a formal process , you've got an audit trail of things that you have tried beforehand and that's , that's a . You know , that is a feature of a fair process that you're able to show what you did , how you did it and the attempts that you've made to try and correct a behavior or a performance issue .

Speaker 2 13:02

So , yeah , I've always encouraged people to say do not worry about it .

Navigating Informal Conflict Resolution Progression

Speaker 2 13:06

I think for me , um , modern technology is often a manager's friend these days , richard , because you can very easily follow up an informal Calixier conversation or meeting with an email just saying thanks for your time . This morning Just wanted to Calixier cover the things that we've agreed and it's set down as an audit trail , then , rather than a personnel file note or anything like that , where it's held by somebody else . The record of the conversation about what was agreed when things were going to be done , I think is essential to resolving the issue and helping an individual to know what needs to be done .

Speaker 1 13:46

And having those elements is really important . But I think also I don't know whether you'd agree with this I sometimes think the tone's quite important because you can write an email to confirm some actions in a way that doesn't sound necessarily draconian or managerialist , that is straightforward and clear but is trying to engage that person , rather than sending something that's going to frighten them as in when it drops into their inbox . So I think tone's quite important in this .

Speaker 2 14:18

It is yeah and tone right throughout from the invite to Calixir , the meeting call somebody , have a conversation with them , because if you're going to be meeting with somebody , sometimes they can as you mentioned , richard , about Calixier managers misunderstanding what's informal and what's formal that play is happening with the employee too . So if we're not clear with the employee look , this is an informal meeting where we need to have a conversation I need to share some things with you . I need to hear what you've got to say and then we're going to agree together what needs to be done about it . If I don't spell that out for the individual at the start , they might think that they're coming to something else . Immediately .

Speaker 2 15:11

I'm getting requests for a companion to come along , um , and before you know it , you know you're spending your time dealing with a kind of process issue rather than the substantive issue that you want to . So , being absolutely clear to people that this is an informal opportunity for the issue to be identified , explored , discussed and actions agreed together is an essential feature of it . And then , as you say , follow that up with . Can I say the way that ? Can I say that is communicated post-meeting .

Speaker 1 15:43

And another aspect to this , I think , is sometimes when you get other people involved , so you might sometimes HR can play quite a positive role in an informal process , or it might be if you have unions in your workplace might be unions , as you mentioned , companions , so work colleagues , et cetera . But one of the key aspects in relation to that , I guess , is that if you start to involve other people , the degree of formality or how it's going to be received by the employee concerns , then that becomes an important factor , doesn't it ?

Speaker 2 16:31

It's absolutely right to turn around and say seeking some guidance from HR or indeed having a conversation with TU side about maybe a wider workplace issue , because often these conflicts are about a misunderstanding of how something is expected to be done or what was agreed in the past , and availing yourself of resources like organisation memory , I think , is a very , very helpful thing . I think the key thing in all of this is signal what you're doing , richard , so agree it and say , look , I'm going to just check in with HR . Or do you think it'd be useful if we did have a conversation with Galaxy on the TU side , because I know they will have been party to discussions over the years on this . Be absolutely clear that that's what you're going to do , and then I think that eliminates that danger of people perceiving the involvement of somebody else unnecessarily formalising it , because it doesn't .

Speaker 1 17:18

Yeah , yeah , being clear about what you're doing , being clear about what you're doing , why you're doing it , I think is absolutely crucial in this . Being clear about what you're doing , being clear about what you're doing , why you're doing it , I think is absolutely crucial in this . So we've talked a bit about informal resolution , what that means , when you might use that . What are the points at which a manager might actually need to take that next step and move towards a more formal process ? Now you know that be through into a disciplinary procedure it might be through a capability procedure or an absence procedure , depending on what you've got in your workplace but what are those sort of trigger points that might actually lead a manager to make the decision ?

Speaker 2 17:54

actually , I need I do need to do something where I might need to make a decision about a warning or a disciplinary sanction or something like that yeah , this is where judgment has to come in and this is where you probably can't write it down to say give somebody two opportunities and then move it on , or three opportunities . I think what you need to do is reflect on the , can I say , the discussion you've had with the individual and look at , can I say , is that informal approach working at all and if it is working , to what degree ? So when you kind of say , like , come out of a calix informal meeting , this is where the clarity of what is going to be done , who's going to be doing it and when is it going to be done by , is absolutely critical , because then you've got a review and you should , in any informal intervention , not leave it open ended . You should always turn around and say let's get back together within a timeframe to review it , and then you would have that conversation . At that point you can look at the degree to which any change has been done .

Speaker 2 19:04

Now and this is where it is difficult and a manager needs to exercise a little bit of the all-round perspective that they have in kind of looking at that situation , because let's say , for example , you've agreed something , um , and you're going to do something by two weeks to improve something , but then you had a bout of illness , richard , so you haven't really had an opportunity to correct or show what you could do . I think in those circumstances you'd say we need to give the informal opportunity a little bit longer to see if it works , rather than jumping into formal processes . However , there will be a point at which the manager may decide I'm not getting enough return from this informal process or I'm not getting any return at all , in which case you do need to collect , say change gear , and perhaps say well , I might need to collect , say move to the formal processes to signal that I'm really serious about this .

Speaker 1 20:05

And then sometimes that signaling is quite important , isn't it ? And that change of gear can actually demonstrate to the individual . There'll be some individual that they do need to do something about . There'll be some individuals who will , sort of like , perhaps be quite relaxed about having those informal conversations and , depending on the person , depending on the personality and the situation , it might need that change of gear just to jolt them into thinking actually , if I don't actually sort this out , then then you know there might be a few more serious implications down the line . Associated with that is . It is an issue which I've seen in organizations quite often , especially when managers again are lacking a bit of confidence . That is a sort of a never-ending process of informal resolution . So it goes on for weeks and weeks and weeks , and it's not just one meeting or two meetings , it's three or four or five or six , and the manager doesn't take that next step . What are the dangers in that sort of situation ?

Speaker 2 21:02

Yeah , that is not unusual dangers in that sort of situation ? Yeah , that that that is not unusual . Um , and indeed um , the manager sometimes in that even stops doing the informal interventions , just says I've , I've given it a go and I no longer do it . I think the risk there is . You have a situation where at least one member of your team will not be doing the job to the expected requirements , and the dangers in that is , resources are very , as I say , stretched in organizations , so the burden either falls on the restay , the team to deliver , or you're constantly never going to be delivering , calixay , the outputs or the expectations expected of your department or team .

Speaker 2 21:52

The other danger is that , calixay again , you get copycat behavior and rather than everybody saying oh , yeah , ok , we'll just carry this individual , you either have people who say well , I'm not going to do it any longer . You might have good people who leave because they say you know , it's just not a fair environment around here . I'm carrying other members , nothing has been done about them . As you said earlier , people start to see and say , oh , I thought the manager was dealing with this , but they're not dealing with any longer . So there's all kinds of can I say issues that are not with not also notwithstanding the performance of the manager being called into question by their superiors , who might be looking and saying your department is not performing to the expected levels . What are you doing about it ?

Speaker 1 22:41

Yeah , and I guess , one last point I want to cover as well before we finish , and that is that there might be some issues that come across a manager's desk which are almost which see which , which may may be such that formal procedure , some sort of formal procedure , some sort of investigation seem inevitable . So it might be , you know , a serious accusation of discrimination or harassment or something like that , something where , which , whether the gut reaction of the manager is this is a serious issue , this needs to go down that formal route . Does some of the informal things we've talked about still have a role to play , even with those issues ? Or are there somewhere ?

Speaker 2 23:21

literally it's just right straight to the investigation and you know , leave , leave it to the formal process well , I think , in terms of going back to , can I say where we started and that , taking a beat that you mentioned and move into the position of responding rather than reacting , um , having that kind of conversation about what's happened you know what has just happened here . I might have had a report of something , but I go to you . There could be an explanation . You know there absolutely could be . Part of that explanation might be yes , I did it , yeah , which might actually eliminate your need for a formal investigation , notwithstanding that you might still be going to , can I say , the formal procedures . So I think there's always a place for it .

Speaker 2 24:07

I think the other thing I would always turn around and say is processes , policies and procedures are there to , can I say , protect the individual employee , the manager and the organisation . So following them is , can I say , absolutely fine . So even if we find ourselves in a formal process , richard , remember , the outcome is not determined by the fact that we are in a formal process . So all outcomes are there . So , yes , there could be sanctions , there could be no action , or it could be sanctioned alongside a referral back to some kind of informal , can I say , intervention . You know we might talk about all kinds of informal interventions . Some of the things that we probably see coming out of some issues are right , we can deal with , can I say , an issue which has occurred , but you've still got to actually have to work together . We might explore mediation type intervention . So I would say don't let the process determine , galaxy , what you , you do .

Speaker 1 25:09

Um , remember your decisions come at the end of it and should be considered in the round there's a danger that the procedure becomes , if you like , a little bit like a , a sort of a , a grinding machine which just inevitably rolls on to a , to a , to a , to an outcome which quite often doesn't actually benefit the organization , the manager or the employee involved . Absolutely sometimes there are , there are opportunities there to go off ramp a little bit and to find a solution midway . Or , as you said , I think it's a really really good advice for managers is that , you know , even if something looks like the sort of issue which is always going to be handled through a formal procedure , even if it's really serious , do a bit of fact finding to begin with , just to see the lie of the land , because , as you say , the individual might want to talk to you and that might make , if it does go to investigation , might make that a lot easier . So maintaining that little bit of informal communication at the beginning is always important in good decision-making in these situations , I think .

Speaker 2 26:12

I absolutely agree . Yeah , and I think the key message is it doesn't prejudice your right to then , can I say , take formal action . And I think sometimes that's one of the worries about can I say , managers , I can't say anything now we are in some formal thing so I've lost control of it . No , the fact that you might reach out and just ask is absolutely fine , and then again it's that taking a beat , considering what you need to do . It hasn't compromised anything and I think sometimes people are a little bit worried that it has , but it hasn't . Sometimes people are a little bit worried that it has , but it hasn't . And again , you know , like formal processes , I do always have to remind people that formal processes do not have to Calixay result in a formal sanction outcome .

Speaker 2 26:59

The decision needs to stand on the basis of what you found as a result of that Calixay process , which , as I've said , can be a multitude of things , and this is the thing where sometimes , managers cry out for consistency and say

Strategic Approaches to Conflict Resolution

Speaker 2 27:11

so . Does every situation that where something has happened lead to the same outcome ? No , the tribunals would expect you to consider things uh , including mitigation in certain circumstances , and that can mean that something on the face of it , which looks like the same offence , leads to two different outcomes because there is differentials that you found out within the process .

Speaker 1 27:34

Yeah , and it brings us full circle really , because I think my advice to managers who are concerned about formal procedure and having to give somebody a disciplinary sanction or the potential for things like litigation , employment tribunals , which I know do worry a lot of managers the best way of avoiding those is to act early and nip the issue in the bud before it escalates . Absolutely , Absolutely . Thanks , Terry . That's been fantastic . Lots of really really valuable information for any manager taking the school managers course and helping them to put some of the principles of that into place in the workplace . So thanks very much and goodbye .